Doing It Differently: Tavi Gevinson and Minna Gilligan in Conversation

Two billion people in the world have internet access and every week, over four million of them visit Rookie, an online publication for teenage girls created in 2010 by Tavi Gevinson. Back then, Tavi was already famed for Style Rookie, a detailed, erudite blog that documented her sartorial inspirations and cultural passions, garnering her an impressive following even then. It was on this platform that in April 2010 she posted about the state of “teen girl” magazines and how something needed to be done to address topics beyond sex, hormones and make-up. This post received such a tidal wave of response that Rookie was born later that year, and became the first magazine to speak directly to a new generation of online teenage girls swirling in a vortex of paranoia-hindered creativity and angst. Remember what a rough ride it was to be 14? Now add the internet. Like the teen magazines of yore, Rookie offers craft tips, style-guides and to-the-point sex advice. On top of that it promotes passion, creativity and exploration, encouraging millions of girls of all ages worldwide to grab life by the horns in their own unique way. Minna Gilligan is a fellow blogger and Melbourne-based artist whose beautiful lo-fi collages have accompanied some of the best Rookie articles from the word go. She and Tavi are close friends and steadfast collaborators whose shared values are obvious in their respective online platforms. With that in mind we asked them to have a discussion on the theme of “doing it differently,” something which they both achieve extraordinarily, effortlessly well. Their preferred choice of interaction? Gmail chat. Tavi Gevinson: Hi! How are you? Minna Gilligan: Good! Looking out over the ocean. How are you? TG I’m good. There are a number of quotations I’ve been writing down in my journal as I plan this year and the year I’m taking off once I graduate high school in four months. “Build a good name for yourself, because eventually that will become your currency,” from William S. Burroughs to Patti Smith. That and the Madonna one you’re obsessed with. MG “I have the same goal I’ve had ever since I was a girl. I want to rule the world.” But it’s not about ruling the world in a dictatorship kind of way, it’s about ruling your own world, being the queen of yourself, and your empire. TG For me it’s not about looking over the New York skyline and going, “One day, I will own this town!” It’s about knowing what is important to me and who I will give my time to when creating stuff publicly tends to attract a few assholes. “Doing it differently” means knowing what is important to you and living by those values. Like when Jamia (Wilson) said that Beyoncé’s album is about being the CEO of your own life, not trying to climb to the top of someone else’s ladder. For the first time since I started blogging at age 11, I finally feel like I do indeed have a place in these fields where I’ve always had a bit of impostor syndrome. And yes, I do think that we as girls are taught to be afraid of our own power, like it makes us dirty or unsexy or scary or threatening. It is a radical act to step outside that and go after what is yours. MG Exactly. I guess from an art point of view I like to think about it as curating my life. Knowing what’s important to me and putting that (people, relationships, projects) in my gallery. Haters and the “few assholes” can come and look and write bad reviews in the paper but they’re still not in the exhibition. This is a corny metaphor but that’s how I think of it. In Australia we have this thing called Tall Poppy Syndrome which I’m fascinated by. It’s when people start to do too well in their field, get lots of opportunities and recognition and people start to tear them down for no good reason. I feel this usually happens to women. Feeling as though you deserve something can take a lot of work to come to terms with; it’s a radical act to stand up and own what you’ve done and be proud of it without giggling or minimising it into insignificance. Actually, you’re the one who taught me to say thank you when I get a compliment, instead of being like, “Oh, it was nothing.” TG That’s a Norwegian thing; you’re supposed to undercut any compliments you get. And it’s certainly specific to women as well. It’s like that Amy Schumer sketch where all these women are standing around complimenting each other and always replying with stuff like, “What are you talking about? I look like shit!” Then one woman comes up and they compliment her and she just goes, “Thank you!” And one by one, they all kill themselves, right there. It’s one of my favourite sketches from any show and captures that phenomenon so succinctly. One reason why I’ve loved having you in the _Rooki_e community is that the idea of success among all of us has always felt like something for everyone to define for themselves. I understand older people being bitter about the way the internet debunks some of the hierarchical structure that they’ve spent years